We want multiplayer for Euro Truck Simulator 2

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gerbiepiep
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Re: We want multiplayer for Euro Truck Simulator 2

#241 Post by gerbiepiep » 20 May 2013 13:02

Ton_majstor wrote:My humble contribution to this:

[ external image ]

:D
This exactly, unless the multiplayer would be made so that others have no influence on you, like drive through ghosting or something.
And definatly not a chat/microphone feature included!

Other than that i wouldnt want multiplayer at all in their truck simulator games, it will make the initial game go up in price, it takes developement time and money away from the main game (wich is singleplayer), requires servers that cost money, and probably will ad a significant amount of bugs/lag/stuttering etc...
P*Funk
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Re: We want multiplayer for Euro Truck Simulator 2

#242 Post by P*Funk » 22 May 2013 23:02

gerbiepiep wrote:
Ton_majstor wrote:My humble contribution to this:

[ external image ]

:D
This exactly, unless the multiplayer would be made so that others have no influence on you, like drive through ghosting or something.
And definatly not a chat/microphone feature included!

Other than that i wouldnt want multiplayer at all in their truck simulator games, it will make the initial game go up in price, it takes developement time and money away from the main game (wich is singleplayer), requires servers that cost money, and probably will ad a significant amount of bugs/lag/stuttering etc...
I find your lack of faith disturbing.

Firstly, the obvious issue of people just being trolls is a problem for every multiplayer game. It exists for anything involving multiple real people so how this would be worse for this game I don't understand. Minecraft is hugely successful and it all basically boils down to people doing the digital version of building castles in the sand. The great image then is some older kid kicking your castle down. Somehow people have thriving Minecraft multiplayer servers. Its astonishing I know. There's this thing called "Moderation" and "Administration" that they do in most communal areas. Its extraordinary. Like most things involving teamwork though it takes dedication, patience, and the right personalities. I play Arma 2 with my clan and we run both a public server and a closed private one. Hackers are a constant problem, but that doesn't deter people from wanting to play together.

As for the notion of multiplay being pointless in a trucking game... well maybe its not the same in Europe but in North America the camaraderie of Trucking is notorious. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_CB_slang
There is this fixed notion in my culture that trucking is basically some fat sweaty guy alone nearly 24/7 on the road in his cab kept company only by other voices on the radio with him all doing the same thing. Its incomprehensible to think that there wouldn't be a thriving group of people who'd want to sit in their cabs and talk to people instead of just doing it alone. There's a reason SCS added the radio feature. They knew you'd get bored listening to the admittedly banal sounds in the game.

As it is I sit in my Arma clan's Teamspeak and talk to my friends while driving a load and comment to them about what I'm doing. I can't see why people wouldn't want to be able to take the conversation into a shared experience, even if its on a map where you don't even see each other. Imagine talking to someone and then seeing them drive by on the road. Imagine being in game and hearing them honk their horn at you as they drive past. That lone would be extraordinary, even without having any game mode other than sharing the roads on pre-existing single player content.

I'm not saying its easy, I'm not even saying its plausible. I'm just disagreeing with the notion that MP isn't fun. This game is a sandbox. Sandbox games are some of the most successful multiplayer games. Consoles have just confused people about it I think. Its changed the vision of multiplayer. PC multiplayer requires no global servers even. Games have lost their server support and communities always create their own matchmaking programs.

GTA never used to have multiplayer. I remember when GTA San Andreas' multiplayer mod came out. It was community made. Imagine that, next version, GTA V, came with multiplayer. They created in GTA SA a multiplayer game without any netcode from Rockstar either, which is the hurdle.

I'm not saying its necessarily plausible, but its possible and frankly its the smartest way for them to sell their game. Single player experiences get lonely, you get used to things. They become predictable, even with mods. Multiplayer lets you play the same thing over and over and somehow still enjoy it because there is new content, you and your friend(s).

The naysayers can say what they want about the likelihood of it happening this version, but I can confidently call them ridiculous for saying that MP wouldn't be fun. Maybe you're just those... peculiar gamers who find some distaste in multiplayer gaming. Your loss, but realize that multiplayer has come in later versions of games specifically because people demanded it or made their own mods, and in the case of Minecraft was even added post release.

MP is the only sensible conclusion to gaming in my opinion. SP is ultimately futile, if you want to keep enjoying something anyway. There are ancient games I still play because of MP that I would never go back to for the SP.
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gerbiepiep
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Re: We want multiplayer for Euro Truck Simulator 2

#243 Post by gerbiepiep » 23 May 2013 11:50

I find your lack of faith disturbing.

If you mean by that faith in online communitys, ive lost that a long time ago by playing various types of online multiplayer games on the PC over the years.

One is worse than another, fool language/behavior, cursing like no other, death treads, ddosing other players for day's by catching their ip's just for the hell of it, attacking the game servers, jealousy resulting in trying to piss you off like no other, idiots no matter the age that scream like complete retards over microphones, blasting their music over microphones, and i could go on and on...

And ofcourse, i am aware of the actuall mature people (by that i mean behavior, NOT age), but the existence of those are slim, and imo decreasing over the years.


Firstly, the obvious issue of people just being trolls is a problem for every multiplayer game. It exists for anything involving multiple real people so how this would be worse for this game I don't understand. Minecraft is hugely successful and it all basically boils down to people doing the digital version of building castles in the sand. The great image then is some older kid kicking your castle down. Somehow people have thriving Minecraft multiplayer servers. Its astonishing I know. There's this thing called "Moderation" and "Administration" that they do in most communal areas. Its extraordinary. Like most things involving teamwork though it takes dedication, patience, and the right personalities. I play Arma 2 with my clan and we run both a public server and a closed private one. Hackers are a constant problem, but that doesn't deter people from wanting to play together.

The times you encounter actuall moderation and administration within games (not counting the forums since those are mostly a mess to), is almost never or not at all.
I'm not necessarily talking about the hacking scum, but more over the general behavior of the actuall players.
I'd wish to see companys/publishers to put some dedication in moderation and administration within online games, but have not seen this happening allot at all, plenty games dont even do that at all.

Hackers/cheaters etc, those are roaming freely around way to much in online games to, they are hard to catch and stop yes, but so many times you see ingame moderaters hardly give a crap about kicking them out or they dont care at all.
And yes, it does drive people away, by dozens everytime again.


As for the notion of multiplay being pointless in a trucking game... well maybe its not the same in Europe but in North America the camaraderie of Trucking is notorious. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_CB_slang
There is this fixed notion in my culture that trucking is basically some fat sweaty guy alone nearly 24/7 on the road in his cab kept company only by other voices on the radio with him all doing the same thing. Its incomprehensible to think that there wouldn't be a thriving group of people who'd want to sit in their cabs and talk to people instead of just doing it alone. There's a reason SCS added the radio feature. They knew you'd get bored listening to the admittedly banal sounds in the game.

I know of CB's being used in trucks, they have also been used, but banned, from normal cars years ago.
Having a virtuall CB could be fun yes, but i'll see it getting spoiled pretty fast with the today's imo rotten interwebs population.


As it is I sit in my Arma clan's Teamspeak and talk to my friends while driving a load and comment to them about what I'm doing. I can't see why people wouldn't want to be able to take the conversation into a shared experience, even if its on a map where you don't even see each other. Imagine talking to someone and then seeing them drive by on the road. Imagine being in game and hearing them honk their horn at you as they drive past. That lone would be extraordinary, even without having any game mode other than sharing the roads on pre-existing single player content.

Teamspeak or any other voice service outside the game is the way to go than in my opinion if you want to hook up with friends.
There you can moderate who's able to come in and talk, not like so many games with a voice service that you have to turn the service off completely cause of idiots ruining it for the descent people.

I'd also like to state that people should get a descent microphone if they want to use a voice service so you could actually hear them clearly instead of crackling/screeching/ear bleeding noises.
Also the random knocking on mics, blowing with mouths into mics etc.
Wich in turn pisses me of resulting in me wanting to disable that persons mic.


I'm not saying its easy, I'm not even saying its plausible. I'm just disagreeing with the notion that MP isn't fun. This game is a sandbox. Sandbox games are some of the most successful multiplayer games. Consoles have just confused people about it I think. Its changed the vision of multiplayer. PC multiplayer requires no global servers even. Games have lost their server support and communities always create their own matchmaking programs.

I have never said MP cant be fun, i know it can, but there is just way and way to many people that kill the fun.
If there was a way to get just the somewhat descent people to play multiplayer games, and block any other, i'm all for it.


GTA never used to have multiplayer. I remember when GTA San Andreas' multiplayer mod came out. It was community made. Imagine that, next version, GTA V, came with multiplayer. They created in GTA SA a multiplayer game without any netcode from Rockstar either, which is the hurdle.


I have played SA:MP and the other version they have for GTA San Andreas for years, had my own server to till it got hacked down a few times.
It's pretty nice, and something like this is better done for a game like ETS2 to in my opinion instead of directly build into the game.
This way SCS Software doesnt have to put up with it either and can spend and work on singleplayer all they want.
You have to take into account that SCS Software is no EA Games or Rockstar and the like, their growing yes, but limmited.


I'm not saying its necessarily plausible, but its possible and frankly its the smartest way for them to sell their game. Single player experiences get lonely, you get used to things. They become predictable, even with mods. Multiplayer lets you play the same thing over and over and somehow still enjoy it because there is new content, you and your friend(s).

I'm pretty sure there is a group of people out there willing and able to make a standalone MP for ETS2 just by theirselves, like others did with GTA3/Vice City/San Andreas/i believe GTA4 to, also Mafia 2, and probably more games.
Maiby some outside coders are already working on it, who knows.


The naysayers can say what they want about the likelihood of it happening this version, but I can confidently call them ridiculous for saying that MP wouldn't be fun. Maybe you're just those... peculiar gamers who find some distaste in multiplayer gaming. Your loss, but realize that multiplayer has come in later versions of games specifically because people demanded it or made their own mods, and in the case of Minecraft was even added post release.

MP is the only sensible conclusion to gaming in my opinion. SP is ultimately futile, if you want to keep enjoying something anyway. There are ancient games I still play because of MP that I would never go back to for the SP.

For years and years on people have played games for hours/days straight while there was not even a connection possible to other ''computer/device'' users, back than that was no issue either.

What bothers me nowdays to is the ''everything has to be online'' mentality allot of people have i.e. facebook.
Or the ''always be connected mentality'', i.e. cell(smart)phones/tablets always dragging with you etc.

Sure the world changes over the years, but it's getting to the point of being rediculous.
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ohaha
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Re: We want multiplayer for Euro Truck Simulator 2

#244 Post by ohaha » 23 May 2013 17:03

I agree MP will be fun, but it is very difficult for SCS to develop it at the moment.
P*Funk wrote:MP is the only sensible conclusion to gaming in my opinion. SP is ultimately futile, if you want to keep enjoying something anyway.
Can you point me to some MP Sudoku servers? I'm having a hard time finding them... :mrgreen:
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P*Funk
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Re: We want multiplayer for Euro Truck Simulator 2

#245 Post by P*Funk » 25 May 2013 02:20

ohaha wrote:Can you point me to some MP Sudoku servers? I'm having a hard time finding them... :mrgreen:
Sudoku isn't a game that involves coding in AI imitations of real human behaviors, nor is it an open world simulation that is expansive beyond the scope of what a single person can experience or interact with directly at any one time.

Besides, I'd say Sudoku is a puzzle more than a game. It has a fixed outcome. Games, especially those involving human opposition, involve usually undetermined outcomes largely decided by decision making or at least involve participation in a shared experience, or at least offer the possibility for it. There is Monopoly which is half human choice but mostly random outcomes based on the Dice, but its still interactive.

I dunno, if I had the choice to play a game with people or sit alone and do Sudoku I'd be wondering why I wasn't doing my Sudoku when nobody was around to play with. :P
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Re: We want multiplayer for Euro Truck Simulator 2

#246 Post by ohaha » 25 May 2013 09:19

P*Funk wrote:
ohaha wrote:Can you point me to some MP Sudoku servers? I'm having a hard time finding them... :mrgreen:
Sudoku isn't a game that involves coding in AI imitations of real human behaviors, nor is it an open world simulation that is expansive beyond the scope of what a single person can experience or interact with directly at any one time.

Besides, I'd say Sudoku is a puzzle more than a game. It has a fixed outcome. Games, especially those involving human opposition, involve usually undetermined outcomes largely decided by decision making or at least involve participation in a shared experience, or at least offer the possibility for it. There is Monopoly which is half human choice but mostly random outcomes based on the Dice, but its still interactive.

I dunno, if I had the choice to play a game with people or sit alone and do Sudoku I'd be wondering why I wasn't doing my Sudoku when nobody was around to play with. :P
I'm glad you get the point. You shouldn't dismiss people for not being a fan of MP, just as none should dismiss your interest in it. Some like it, some not. But neither side must be judged, for their preferences. :)
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hippo
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Re: We want multiplayer for Euro Truck Simulator 2

#247 Post by hippo » 29 May 2013 09:37

gerbiepiep wrote:
[snip] and something like this is better done for a game like ETS2 to in my opinion instead of directly build into the game.
This way SCS Software doesnt have to put up with it either and can spend and work on singleplayer all they want.
You have to take into account that SCS Software is no EA Games or Rockstar and the like, their growing yes, but limmited.
I like this idea best. SCS keep doing what they are doing, but build in some hooks for an outside group to build the MP part. SCS treat the MP like they treat mods. Hands off.

I guess if they are adding telemetry output, then as long as it works as an input too, the hooks for MP are going to be there.

I play most of my games SP. I like it like that personally and want to keep it that way. ETS2, X3TC, even my driving sims, rFactor, GTR2 etc that are multi player I usually drive SP.
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Re: We want multiplayer for Euro Truck Simulator 2

#248 Post by ksrele » 29 May 2013 10:40

hippo wrote:
I like this idea best. SCS keep doing what they are doing, but build in some hooks for an outside group to build the MP part. SCS treat the MP like they treat mods. Hands off.
Did I talk about this all the time?
SCS doesn't have to do anything if they don't want to, they can just simply give someone authorisation and memory locations (only not whole code) and that is all.
hippo wrote: I guess if they are adding telemetry output, then as long as it works as an input too, the hooks for MP are going to be there.
Sorry but I think that telemetry is for some hardware game modules (speed and RPM guages, gear number, blinkers...). This is very cool and step to full simulation.
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Re: We want multiplayer for Euro Truck Simulator 2

#249 Post by altx » 29 May 2013 11:01

ksrele wrote: Did I talk about this all the time?
SCS doesn't have to do anything if they don't want to, they can just simply give someone authorisation and memory locations (only not whole code) and that is all.
No. You should agree to some interface, for the reason that you want to minimize the risk that changes in ETS will break your mod (and the other way around). SCS should provide some API/SDK which you can use to develop the multiplayer part then.
Using memory locations, however, is very error-prone.
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ksrele
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Re: We want multiplayer for Euro Truck Simulator 2

#250 Post by ksrele » 29 May 2013 13:02

Yes API/SDK will be better but it demands programming but giving out memory location for every new game version is much easier.
But I think that even SCS don't know those locations so... :)
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