Potential New PC Build, Thoughts?

[mackintosh]

Actually, I bought mine at Proshop, they only had 15 in stock, and you're quite right, the website fell over and I was lucky enough to be one of the first people who refreshed when it went back live

[Some newbie driver]

I heard of a few people that had the same kind of luck. Sometimes perseveration has it's reward; but not everybody has the time for it.

In my case, I should had to change the GPU almost 3 months ago but I'm not even trying. The way the market is, either it's a waste of time or I would end paying an enormous extra price. So a headphones with better noise isolation so I could ignore for more time that damn vent noise had end being a purchase good enough for me... for the moment.

[mackintosh]

True that. I have the upside of being the boss, so I can sit behind the desk and F5 hardware websites as long as I like Jokes aside though, I could have just as well bought it for scalper prices, but I make it a point, just like you, not to overpay for hardware. Even if the 3090 is so very tempting

[Some newbie driver]

It's not just scalpers. Retailers themselves have seen that everything is being sold. Demand and supply basic laws of market.

The reference retailer here in Spain (a very reputed one, not for best prices but reliability and good practices) has been selling recently (the few stock they had) the 6800 at prices way higher than 6800 XT MSRP (as an example, but everything is looking the same). I'm not going to pay those prices. I've lots of other way more important things where to spent my money. And even if not, I would still not pay those prices. They cost that now, but it's not their value.

[Reignman]

Haha, no I'm not discouraged, it was just something I found fascinating, so decided to share it. This is something I mentioned earlier in the thread, about how people should stop complaining about the bots and actually help people combat the bots? This guy is using his bot program to actually help people and that's what we need more of. Yeah I know I'd need my own bot program to beat them, but I'm not actually trying to get any of these GPU's. I'm holding out for a 3060 at the end of February, and hopefully Newegg continues it's raffle program with them, but if I have trouble getting one, I'll consider trying to find one of these bot programs of my own. Just to get the 1 GPU I need though, not to become a scalper lol.

In my case, I should had to change the GPU almost 3 months ago but I'm not even trying. The way the market is, either it's a waste of time

If I had even a half way decent PC, I wouldn't even try building one now either. I would have even stopped had I not already bought some of the parts before the market went crazy. But I'm borderline desperate with this 12yo pile of crap at this point lol.

After 3 months of trying though, I finally got Service Pack 1 installed (Windows 7). Microsoft no longer supports it, so I had to go digging for it. With SP1 I was finally able to get all of the redistributable packages installed which has allowed me to play more of my games again and use some programs. For awhile there I pretty much only had ATS lol. So that's a relief. That buys me a little more patience.

I could have just as well bought it for scalper prices, but I make it a point, just like you, not to overpay for hardware. Even if the 3090 is so very tempting

Same here. I could pay the higher prices and be done with it, but I have my principles lol. I refuse to pay the marked up prices from retailers, and I absolutely won't buy from a scalper under any circumstance. It's MSRP or nothing. I don't need a new PC, I just want one, so I don't need to sell a kidney or anything. I have the patience to play this game, as frustrating as it's been sometimes lol. This thread is testament to that. So far I've gotten most parts below MSRP and free shipping by waiting for deals, so I feel like I'm winning the game. I paid MSRP for the 5600X, but it cost me a bit on shipping. The RAM is probably the only part I've lost money on so far and that's because prices have gone up recently. I could have got the 16GB for around $70 a couple months ago, but ended up paying $80 when it went on sale recently. Not too big of a hit. Now I just gotta find a deal on a PSU, and hope the 3060's aren't too much more than the $329 MSRP. Without a founders edition, the rumors suggest partner prices will be a little higher. How much? I hope not more than $350.

It's not just scalpers. Retailers themselves have seen that everything is being sold. Demand and supply basic laws of market.

The only MSRP that I've seen retailers mess around with has been the R5 3600, and maybe RAM. I've seen the 3600 go from $160 last summer to $240 this fall with retailers only. The 3700X didn't experience such an increase. GPU's either really, until supply was almost down to nothing. I could have bought my 2060 for $330 for the longest time, but stubborn and stupid me refused to pay more than $300 for one lol. I've even seen them drop to $310 but I still wasn't budging from my $300 point xD. They were selling for $280 for a short time in April.

So yeah this whole time I probably could have been using a 3600/2060 rig and this thread would have ended after page 5 or whatever, but I'm not really disappointed I missed out on that setup. I'll be satisfied if I can land a 3060 soon after launch. If I have to wait until April or May, then that'll suck because it doesn't look like I'll be getting that APU anytime soon either.

[Reignman]

So I guess the 3060's launch on the 25th, so 11 days to go. Man I really hope Newegg has a raffle for them because I don't see myself getting one otherwise. Because I've been practicing with that live stream on YT with the bot that alerts you whenever a 3000 series is in stock and they're always gone by the time I click the link. Who knows, maybe it's just a troll who randomly posts links to GPU's that were already sold out lol.

Newegg has been raffling 3070's, but never the 3060ti's, so not sure what's going on there. Also I don't like how they've been raffling the 3070's as combo packs. Usually with a motherboard or PSU, so I hope they don't pull that nonsense with the 3060's.

Worst of all, the 3200g never comes in stock either. I still need to figure out how I'm going to flash the BIOS, but I can't really do that until I have a GPU or that APU. I'd like to use the APU first, before I try the AMD loaner program. You have to ship the loaner back to AMD in 10 days. I really don't want to have to send my MB back to ASUS. If I manage to land a 3060 right away and still don't have the BIOS flashed, I'll just order the cheapest Ryzen 3 I can find and return it. It'll be just my luck to finally get this PC finished but can't get the BIOS flashed lol. That's Reignman's Law right there.

[Some newbie driver]

That or to settle to a cheap Zen2 Ryzen you can find (that wouldn't be a bad CPU anyway) and save that money (not only on CPU, but in deliveries up and down for the BIOS flash). In a near future you can use that saved bucks for the GPU as it's going to be hard to find anything near MSRP.

You have to consider too that AM4 socket support will end in this Ryzen 3 generation (confirmed several times). This means that, once Zen4 CPUs get launched (expected in late 2021); the pressure over Zen3 prices should had to lower (yeah, I know I said I don't wanted to forecast anymore ). But really, if the new Zen4 are so good as all the info leakings suggest, people is going to go crazy for them. That could be a good moment to do your final upgrade for long term on that computer: replace the cheap Zen2 purchased now (that allowed you to use the computer and flash the BIOS) and acquire a beefier Zen3 at a lower price and with the saved money you don't spent now (if any).

Regards

[Reignman]

Damn AMD and their confusing zen label. I keep getting zen confused with gen xD. The cheapest Zen2 I can find is the R5 3600 for $200 lol. My MB supports down to zen+ without a flash, but I never see any of those in stock anywhere. Only the 2600, which is $195, so not much better there. AMD uses a 3100 in their loaner program, and it's only $100 MSRP, but it's only being sold by 3rd party atm for $180. Price doesn't really matter I guess, if I return it. I just need to buy one that has a 30 day money back refund policy, which Newegg has.

You have to consider too that AM4 socket support will end in this Ryzen 3 generation (confirmed several times). This means that, once Zen4 CPUs get launched (expected in late 2021);

That soon already huh? I figured they'd ride the 5000 series well into 2022.

I was aware that this was the end of the AM4 socket, which kinda screwed up my plans a little, maybe. The main reason I chose AMD over Intel was so I could upgrade when needed without having to buy a new MB. That was when I was still planning to buy the 3600 and would have had plenty of upgrade options. I still have a few options up to the 5950X. If I ever need a 5900X or 5950X, it would probably last me until I needed to build a whole new PC anyway. I might get a full 10 years out of the 5600X, hopefully, which is why I eventually chose it over the 3600. Why buy a $200 CPU now and have to buy a new $300 CPU in 5 years when I can just buy the $300 one now and maybe get 10 years out of it? I don't know, but I'm sure the DIY gods will find a way to punish me for it lol.

What zen will AMD be on in 10 years? That'll probably be the next time I'm in the market, and hopefully by then they got this crap figured out. I mean with bots/scalpers and supply/demand. Hopefully they build more semiconductor plants. According to GN ... AMD, Intel, and Nvidia are pushing to get one built in the US. I'm surprised everyone isn't pushing for that since everyone has been affected by supply/demand with covid.

Speaking of bots, I already started researching that avenue too lol. I went looking for one and actually found several that people have been willing to share. Tomshardware has even had some articles about setting up bots. Most are python scripts, and seem a little confusing, but I can probably get it figured out. Fight bots with bots as they say. Or as one comment said, "if everyone is using a bot, then nobody is using a bot" lol. That'll just be the new way technology is purchased until the tech companies can keep up with demand.

[Some newbie driver]

That soon already huh? I figured they'd ride the 5000 series well into 2022.

Well, the initial leaks pointed 2022 and it could still be depending on the circumstances. But some mixed news here and there aim for sooner release. Probably AMD willing to leverage the crest of the wave they are in. Compare it with Intel, that had publicly stated that it's going to release gen 11 in a few weeks and Gen 12 this very same year (and not being compatible chipsets it seems ). Sometimes it seems they laugh at the face of their customers.

I was aware that this was the end of the AM4 socket, which kinda screwed up my plans a little, maybe. The main reason I chose AMD over Intel was so I could upgrade when needed without having to buy a new MB. That was when I was still planning to buy the 3600 and would have had plenty of upgrade options.

Of course, you initial plans were to purchase previous gen and almost a year ago; what would had ended in a good PC that could had been upgraded to a high-end Ryzen 9 5900X for cheap four years later and last you 6 years more. Wasn't a bad plan but you should had to be able to purchase something then. Crazy COVID times.

Fight bots with bots as they say. Or as one comment said, "if everyone is using a bot, then nobody is using a bot"

That's like the nuclear weapons race and we all know how it ended. The big fished in the pool always eat the small ones no matter it seems they all have the same weapons.

Regards

[Reignman]

Compare it with Intel, that had publicly stated that it's going to release gen 11 in a few weeks and Gen 12 this very same year (and not being compatible chipsets it seems ). Sometimes it seems they laugh at the face of their customers.

Makes you wonder if they're getting a kickback from the motherboard manufacturers lol. I was already soured on Intel shortly after I built my current rig in 2008. Their i series wasn't quite a thing yet, so I got a core 2 quad. Then the i series came and I couldn't upgrade to it without getting a new MB. Last summer when I first started researching PC stuff for a new build, that was one of the first things I considered, and I was disappointed to see they still went with a new socket with each new release. I thought that was just the industry standard until I looked at AMD.

Of course, you initial plans were to purchase previous gen and almost a year ago; what would had ended in a good PC that could had been upgraded to a high-end Ryzen 9 5900X for cheap four years later and last you 6 years more.

Maybe I should have stuck with that plan lol. And maybe I would have if the 3600 wasn't still sitting at $200. It was $160 last summer, so in my mind $200 is a rip off. Especially after seeing rumors of a 5600 for $220. Which didn't launch in January like people thought. That was the one I really wanted. I didn't want to pay $300 for a CPU. So without a 5600 I figured the $300 5600X was my best option when I learned it was better than the 3700X. I never would have paid $325 for a 3700X, but had it dropped down to $300 I would have considered it, or had I never been able to win a 5600X. The original plan was to get a 3600 now, then a 3700X or 3900 later (before I knew about the 5000 series), but yeah a 3600 now and a 5800X or 5900X in a few years still probably would have been the best plan, and I probably would have gone that route had the 3600 ever came back below $200. But as we've learned, we can't predict these things anymore, and I just want it to be over with lol.

That's like the nuclear weapons race and we all know how it ended. The big fished in the pool always eat the small ones no matter it seems they all have the same weapons.

Well that's one way to look at it, another way is evolution lol. You have to adapt to your environment or you go extinct. The big fish are too greedy and aren't showing any signs of stopping. Worst of all, retailers aren't doing much to combat the problem. Newegg has at least gone with this shuffle program, but I don't think they care too much because they're getting their money either way. I've never seen a shuffle for a 3060ti so that's a bit concerning.

In fact I just realized Newegg (or maybe the GPU partners) are charging $150-200 above MSRP for the 3060ti's and 3070's. Even higher for the 3080's and 90's. So the scalping is helping them make money too. A very bad sign for my 3060 aspirations. I had hoped to get one for no more than $350, but now I'm thinking I won't get one for under $450 even through a normal retailer. I can't afford to wait another 6 months or more for the market to stabilize, and it wouldn't make much sense to spend $100 on a temporary GPU while I wait. I might as well spend that extra $100 and buy the 3060 at $450. It looks like I won't have a choice. I wouldn't even pay $200 for a 2060 right now.

I'm playing the Newegg shuffle to see how long it takes me to win a 3070 (which I won't buy), and I noticed Newegg was charging $670+ for them, depending on the brand. The MSRP is $500. So yeah, if the MSRP of a 3060 is $330, I won't see them for less than $450. I lost the shuffle on 2 3070's today, which I'm only playing to try to get an idea of how long it might take to win a 3060 lol. I also lost my last 2 attempts to win another 5600X, which I'm only playing to get a feel for the odds. It took me 4 tries to win the first one, so did I just get lucky, or is supply looking better? Supply must be better for CPU's because they haven't raised the price on them like they did the GPU's. But like I mentioned before, maybe it was the partners who raised the prices and not Newegg.