Iberia Discussion

[2Beers]

Hi guys,

just my 2c about Iberia. It's really good, very vast environment, the landscape looks so familiar, if you've ever been to Spain / Portugal, so much to see, so much difference.
Best DLC so far, thank you.

Also about 1.40, the new lighting system is just phenomenal, it makes such a difference .. the street lights, lights at the different truck stops, signal lights from police / ambulance, reflections in the cabin, it's just great. Thank you again.
Keep up the good work.

[Vinnie Terranova]

I know the mileage of a few DLC because it was included in their announcements when released. Do somebody has all the values?

No, not all values are known. I know the values of a few DLC. I don't know the values of the basemap. But there are more problems with calculating:
- England is in 1:15 instead of 1:19 scale;
- The known values are the values at the moment the DLCs were released. But SCS has added more roads: road connections to upcoming DLCs, reworks of Germany, Travemunde, Corsica, reworks in France, etc, etc. So the known values of the DLC are pretty useless.

[festmache]

Hi guys, I'm trying to find the real-life locations of some places I passed by. Does anyone know where the stadium is that's close to Madrid's ring road on the south side?

I think the ring road is the M-40 and it should be between its intersections with the A-5 and the A-4... I can't find it on Google Maps
Or is the stadium actually located elsewhere and placed near the in-game roundabout for convenience? Artistic freedom?

[Esproquet]

In the south side it has to be Coliseum Alfonso Pérez, Getafe football club stadium. Wanda Metropolitano (Atlético de Madrid) can be seen to the east. Check my signature link for further info.

https://www.google.com/search?client=ms ... 9&dpr=2.75

[NARS]

Semitrailers and Trailers are 80 on Motorways and 70 on Expressways, 90 is only for the tractor unit, dont know about a rigid

Wrong! In Portugal is 90 for tractor units with semi-trailer and 80 for rigid trucks with trailer!

[mackintosh]

Yeah, we've been discussing this in the bug thread, looks like SCS got this very wrong. Hopefully they'll fix it asap. In their defense though, even the European Commission has the wrong speed limits, as do most English language websites. Nevertheless, this should have been properly researched during preproduction.

[Some newbie driver]

I missed the way you did it @krmarci. Let's see what I get.

M are the total km of previous map
I are the total km of Iberia
D are the total kilometer he has drove just before the DLC purchase.

Then, D=0,9310M and D=0,7348(M+I)
I equal D and have that 0,9310M=0,7348M+0,7348I
So 0,1962M=0.7378I
Aisle the I gives me 0.2658M=I

We also know that 300km increased 0,23% the counter with the whole map; so:
300=0,0023(M+I)
M+I=300/0,0023
M+I = 130.435 rounding up (that would be the amount of road km we have now in total)
Aisle the I gives me I=130.435-M

Now if I equal the two formulas with I then 0.2658M = 130.435-M
M= (130.435/0.2658) - (M/0.2658)
M+(M/0.2658)=490.726
M=103.045 (that's would be the size in KM of the previous map)

Now I've one of the two values, I can replace in one of the two previous results (for example I=0.2658M)
Then I=0.2658 * 103.045
I=27.390km

Considering I rounded in a few places, pretty similar values as yours; let's say we arrived the same value. But not the same conclusion, I'm pretty sure that value is significantly over the real one. What's the problem then? That Iberia doesn't have the size of more than 1/4 all the previous map (That's the meaning of the formula isolated as 0.2658M=I). So plain and simple: Its big, but not so much. There's at least 4 things that make those calculations to fail (that if I didn't do any step wrong):

1- As I said earlier, discovery % includes lots of things that doesn't have length. Their individual weight is small, but there are thousands of them.
2- As I said earlier too; regular roads are discovered in a block, but all junctions in newer DLC count every piece apart, included different directions of the same main road. Both things distort the value of road km and also undervalues the weight of older map, GE and part of Scandinavia in the % of discovery.
3- LopeszTiago should confirm us if the 93.10% discovery was only before Iberia or if it updated to 1.40 the same moment he purchased Iberia. 1.40 brought a lot of map additions and changes that would significantly count on that reduction to 73,48% of discovery he had.
4- As @Vinnie Terranova said, the factor of the 1:15 scale of UK; that could distort the value depending on how SCS is calculating the %

If I had to bet, I would put Iberia around 20.000km; and that would be already 30% over the biggest previous DLC at launch (France has gained around than 2.000km of roads since then) and near 1/6th the whole previous map. As I said: really big, but not so much. That would be my guess.

Regards

[Vøytek]

Nonsense. If anything, Google Street View is an exceptional resource and is especially perfectly suited to this particular task. Besides, they have no issues with getting signs right in ATS. Signs have been an Achilles heel since forever, and unlike ATS, there is nothing being done about it, other than some cosmetic changes here and there.

As I'm seeing such comments, I'll just drop a comparison of few signs. Unfortunately, orange tape ruins them a bit. Also, when I compare them now (and look at them closely), I can see some tiny font size issues etc. Keep in mind you'll never spot this when driving, unless you stop, take a screenshot and decide to compare it with SV... There are problems, of course, I'm a human too and make mistakes. But still, I'm really proud of my work. I added some old, weird designs (1st sign) and details such as slightly different brown shade for the Calahorra sign (if you look closely, there's even a bit of white-ish tape under CHERÍN!). That's just a small selection of hundreds of almost 1:1 signs I managed to recreate.
https://i.imgur.com/Pm1dFo9.png
Here you can actually see the difference in the amount of sign templates
https://i.imgur.com/rnKQqWT.png

About ATS - keep in mind that's one country. There's one, clear system, which our ATS sign magician had to learn once and then improve his knowledge with plenty of examples during few years of development, to the point when he's familiar with it like with his own country's system and he knows what he can or can't do with it.

Now take a look at Europe. Every year there's a new region, which has completely different sign design. And Spain is known to have a huge mess on signs, which isn't that easy to represent in this scale, with missing roads or cities. It has to be studied from hundreds of examples before you start. And then you still learn more and more when working with those crazy Spanish signs, and in the end of development you even find some unique examples, which surprise you. I decided to include few of such unique, random signs, to improve the immersion.
Also, Iberia is huge. Colorado was 2 times smaller. It's impossible for 2-3 people to sign it 100% correctly and without some simplifications.

I hope some of you still enjoy this hard work, despite some problems which don't make me happy either

[P3TER_]

I missed the way you did it @krmarci. Let's see what I get.

M are the total km of previous map
I are the total km of Iberia
D are the total kilometer he has drove just before the DLC purchase.

Then, D=0,9310M and D=0,7348(M+I)
I equal D and have that 0,9310M=0,7348M+0,7348I
So 0,1962M=0.7378I
Aisle the I gives me 0.2658M=I

We also know that 300km increased 0,23% the counter with the whole map; so:
300=0,0023(M+I)
M+I=300/0,0023
M+I = 130.435 rounding up (that would be the amount of road km we have now in total)
Aisle the I gives me I=130.435-M

Now if I equal the two formulas with I then 0.2658M = 130.435-M
M= (130.435/0.2658) - (M/0.2658)
M+(M/0.2658)=490.726
M=103.045 (that's would be the size in KM of the previous map)

Now I've one of the two values, I can replace in one of the two previous results (for example I=0.2658M)
Then I=0.2658 * 103.045
I=27.390km

Considering I rounded in a few places, pretty similar values as yours; let's say we arrived the same value. But not the same conclusion, I'm pretty sure that value is significantly over the real one. What's the problem then? That Iberia doesn't have the size of more than 1/4 all the previous map (That's the meaning of the formula isolated as 0.2658M=I). So plain and simple: Its big, but not so much. There's at least 4 things that make those calculations to fail (that if I didn't do any step wrong):

1- As I said earlier, discovery % includes lots of things that doesn't have length. Their individual weight is small, but there are thousands of them.
2- As I said earlier too; regular roads are discovered in a block, but all junctions in newer DLC count every piece apart, included different directions of the same main road. Both things distort the value of road km and also undervalues the weight of older map, GE and part of Scandinavia in the % of discovery.
3- LopeszTiago should confirm us if the 93.10% discovery was only before Iberia or if it updated to 1.40 the same moment he purchased Iberia. 1.40 brought a lot of map additions and changes that would significantly count on that reduction to 73,48% of discovery he had.
4- As @Vinnie Terranova said, the factor of the 1:15 scale of UK; that could distort the value depending on how SCS is calculating the %

If I had to bet, I would put Iberia around 20.000km; and that would be already 30% over the biggest previous DLC at launch (France has gained around than 2.000km of roads since then) and near 1/6th the whole previous map. As I said: really big, but not so much. That would be my guess.

Regards

I've made a sum of all roads I've already layed out in Maps of RttBS and with Romania fully done and Bulgaria almost (and Turkey only motorways) I come at 6323 km. Compared to the 10.000 km, this is quite somewhat off, but I haven't calculated roads like those in Hungary or secondaries in Turkey (and some Bulgarian). Furthermore, I've missed some (unmarked) roads in all countries. Once I complete this DLC, I'll post the final result, after which I probably start doing Iberian roads. That way we can calibrate how far off RttBS is, and correct the Iberian number to match that of a number that could have been displayed on Steam.

[Some newbie driver]

And then you still learn more and more when working with those crazy Spanish signs, and in the end of development you even find some unique examples, which surprise you.

I warned Kraake that, for the signs team, Spain was going to be a pain in the place where the back loses its name.

Did Pavel granted you extra holidays? On a mental recovery institution?