why scs software doesn't care about graphics in game?

Optional Features
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Re: why scs software doesn't care about graphics in game?

#291 Post by Optional Features » 16 May 2022 20:46

Shiva wrote: 16 May 2022 20:28 Rockstar North? 650 working there (2018). Now it seems to be over 1k, according to a webpage.
SCS 170 (+30 contractors) (2019)

Rockstar North, seems to have revenue 10x that of SCS. Or close to it.

Regarding the scale etc? ETS2 and ATS are around 1:20. That goes to more than a few of your points.
You know those places you can't enter in ATS and ETS2, atleast those on streets going away from where you can drive? Visiting those, you would soon see that they are scenery, with less detail, ending in non driveable areas.
Made so the world seems bigger than it is.

1 point you are spot on tho. More pedestrians would be nice.

Do you make lists as these on iRacing, MSFS and more, forums?


And for your other post?
You really need to visit that bank with the truck? or whatever it is and get stuck with the truck?
Revenue is just a measure of success. It's not a measure of skill. There are skilled people who are not rich, and rich people who are not skilled. The same applies to companies. We shouldn't look at Rockstar's money and expect them naturally to have a better product. In some areas, they do. In others, they clearly don't.

Yes, the barricades are a constant pet peeve of mine, especially when they block clearly detailed areas from the player's use.

Here's one good example. Road looks decently detailed to me, yet it's not on the map and my attempts to drive down it were met with a brick wall. This road connects two driveable roads, yet it's not driveable. Why?

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As for the gates and barricades in front of everything, yes, those also annoy me. No, I can't fit a semi in there, but I don't need a brick wall to show me that. I can figure that out by myself.

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This game treats me like I'm a child, needing to have my hand held around the virtual world. I should be able to park here if I so desire, especially if using a car mod.
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Re: why scs software doesn't care about graphics in game?

#292 Post by xXCARL1992Xx » 16 May 2022 20:49

great then, because the game can be played by a child also, i dont see an 18+ logo on it or UKS18/Pegi18 rating or whatever (Rated M+ i think in the US) :rofl:
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Optional Features
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Re: why scs software doesn't care about graphics in game?

#293 Post by Optional Features » 16 May 2022 20:49

abasstreppas wrote: 16 May 2022 20:45 OffTopic : Just curious, what's the reason for your nick, as I haven't seen any mods made by you? :?
I use the same username on multiple platforms. But no, I'm not an SCS-game modder. For the level of effort necessary to make something work in this game, I could make something work in a different game, and by work, I mean actually be functional.

I play this game because of the longer drive distances, but I wish it offered just a little bit more. It's clear that the best community ever disagrees.

As for the "niche" game comments, I think this is largely by SCS design. If they had made a more free and open world that players could have a much greater impact on, I think a number of communities would have developed within the larger driving community. Open world driving games are rare, and this one has one of the better maps. But the abundant limitations in gameplay, interactivity, even the ability to mod make it very unappealing for anyone wanting to do anything other than just drive a truck with invisible cargo from one point to another.
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Re: why scs software doesn't care about graphics in game?

#294 Post by Optional Features » 16 May 2022 21:16

If we can make any comparison to Rockstar, it's that Rockstar would have made all of these areas driveable. I was at a hotel last Friday, and I saw four semis in the parking lot, most without trailers. For SCS hotels, most of the time I can't even get to the parking lot, let alone sleep.

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On this one, SCS chose the oldest warehouse prefab to make the functional company, and blocked off more than half of the area.

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This one, which would have been a perfect place to put a trucking company garage, is completely decorative.

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And this one, a famous (and fragrant) real life plant in Denver is also completely decorative, made functional so far by only one private modder in the community.

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It should be one of the best delivery prefabs in the game, even if the in-game company was totally unrelated to what it does irl. All it needed was a trigger.

When I see this map, I see missed opportunities. I see places I could set up my company. I see homes I could deliver goods to. I see stadiums that I could supply with materials and equipment for events.

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This is all within the current map, and all not currently in use.
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Re: why scs software doesn't care about graphics in game?

#295 Post by Grizzly » 16 May 2022 21:49

koolizz wrote: 16 May 2022 10:41 I always ask myself, if these users here have such deep knowledge and expertise in game development and all other subjects that they keep telling us with such confidence that we "know nothing about it" - why do they spend most their own time on a truck sim forum telling others they know nothing about game development and these subjects? Strange way to spend your time as a developer, I say that as a developer myself. No developers, teachers, mentors or experts on any subjects I have met spend their days telling others "you don't know anything about x" when discussions arise. I have actually never met a person knowledgeable about any subject that express themselves like that. Statements like that should serve as a big alarm bell. True experts on topics with actual knowledge don't react like that when their views are challenged. But some people don't want a discussion, they just want to shut down an opinion that goes against theirs.
This has got to be satire, right?
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Re: why scs software doesn't care about graphics in game?

#296 Post by Travismods » 16 May 2022 21:58

@seriousmods All this is true, and the reason for it is simply because the community does not demand more of SCS. If they did 5 years ago, we'd maybe at least would have had some of those functional today. But very few do, and even those that do are mostly ignored. Instead we clap and clap for every little UI tweak, copy paste map DLC with 95% rehashed assets and same limitations or once a year a static brick of a truck model we can drive from A to B as a brand simulator and then press finish job and so here we are. As long as the community does not demand the game be more than that, nothing will change. No dirt, no seasons, no walk mode, no tire physics, no PBR, no wind dynamics, no LTL, no pre trip inspections, no securing cargo, no functioning truck yards, no nothing. We know that SCS aim with this game is more or less about completing the US map on the same old technology, with the same approach and with mostly the same limitations - because it has worked for them so far. Not enough people are complaining. Bucks are being made. DX12 can come and go and bring minor fixes, but SCS design philosophy will stay. The unwillingness to demand more is set in stone in this community and its not going away either. Time will tell what will happen but some people would interpret this as a recipe for a dying game and community.

I mean, look at where we are now, SCS only just now went to Canada to record proper truck sounds and horns. People have been complaining about the sounds since release. It is getting fixed, finally. After 7 years. Imagine, imagine what the wait is until some of these other, perhaps even more important things than sound, are addressed. Will we even be alive to see it? Will SCS still even be a company? At this snail rate, one has to ask.
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Re: why scs software doesn't care about graphics in game?

#297 Post by abasstreppas » 16 May 2022 22:05

You may one day realise that if people in general are not complaining is because the game actually is a very good product?

Most of you who complain in numbers are actually very few, just saying...
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Re: why scs software doesn't care about graphics in game?

#298 Post by Travismods » 16 May 2022 22:19

Yeah, the horse and carriage was also a superior form of transportation until the car came along. Most of this community would have sat in that carriage going "this is probably the best and fastest we can do. What are you complaining about? We are getting from A to B". That's what we are talking about here, not that we can't enjoy a ride in a horse and a carriage once in a while. SCS is still top dog because no real competitor in trucksim is here...yet. Doesn't mean what they are doing is at some objectively high level of quality though and that we shouldnt complain and demand more. Your "very good product" is relative and means nothing. If there were 5 big truck simulator developers, and SCS was beating them by a long shot with features and graphics, yeah, then I could agree with making a statement like "this is a very good product". As it is now it is only deemed good because it still lacks competition. The only thing we can really compare ATS to is the real life depiction of a truck driver driving and managing trucks, which is what ATS is trying to simulate after all - and in that respect, its pretty poor as it is still completely missing most aspects of being a truck driver.
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Re: why scs software doesn't care about graphics in game?

#299 Post by VTXcnME » 16 May 2022 22:23

koolizz wrote: 16 May 2022 21:58 @seriousmods All this is true, and the reason for it is simply because the community does not demand more of SCS. If they did 5 years ago, we'd maybe at least would have had some of those functional today. But very few do, and even those that do are mostly ignored. Instead we clap and clap for every little UI tweak, copy paste map DLC with 95% rehashed assets and same limitations or once a year a static brick of a truck model we can drive from A to B as a brand simulator and then press finish job and so here we are. As long as the community does not demand the game be more than that, nothing will change. No dirt, no seasons, no walk mode, no tire physics, no PBR, no wind dynamics, no LTL, no pre trip inspections, no securing cargo, no functioning truck yards, no nothing. We know that SCS aim with this game is more or less about completing the US map on the same old technology, with the same approach and with mostly the same limitations - because it has worked for them so far. Not enough people are complaining. Bucks are being made. DX12 can come and go and bring minor fixes, but SCS design philosophy will stay. The unwillingness to demand more is set in stone in this community and its not going away either. Time will tell what will happen but some people would interpret this as a recipe for a dying game and community.

I mean, look at where we are now, SCS only just now went to Canada to record proper truck sounds and horns. People have been complaining about the sounds since release. It is getting fixed, finally. After 7 years. Imagine, imagine what the wait is until some of these other, perhaps even more important things than sound, are addressed. Will we even be alive to see it? Will SCS still even be a company? At this snail rate, one has to ask.
7 years and still no improved draw distances. No multicore support. No cargo expansion. No economic system. No weather improvements (to include as you mentioned seasons). The things that are in game are half baked.

Agree with all of it.

A lot of hopes and dreams are being pinned on DX12. I don't think it's going to be the savior everyone expects.
abasstreppas wrote: 16 May 2022 22:05 You may one day realise that if people in general are not complaining is because the game actually is a very good product?

Most of you who complain in numbers are actually very few, just saying...
If you read through the wish list threads, the next version speculation threads, and some of the other wants and wishes threads I think you'll see that there is a lot of folks looking for more out of this game. Saying there's only few people expecting more is intentionally ignoring of all those threads with hundreds of participants and thousands of posts asking, in some cases begging for more features/functionality or just overall improvement of the product. Maybe we generalize complaints different. When I look at posts with feature requests. Or threads on "What do you hope makes version 1.XX?" I see that as people voicing a desire for more. SCS is obviously somewhat sedintary when it comes to pushing for more.

I can agree there's some that are more vocal about wanting more than others. But there's certainly more than just a few looking for more out of this game.
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Re: why scs software doesn't care about graphics in game?

#300 Post by angrybirdseller » 16 May 2022 22:36

I can tell who played ETS2 in 2013 or early years as they understand improvements take years.

There is diminishing returns with graphical improvements where resources may be better spent on gameplay features.

I have seen ETS2 and ATS evolved over time with content and detail it's alot better than 2016 even.

The overwhelming majority like playing ATS and ETS2 same with GTA V but they also have two different base of customers as well.
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