Kansas Discussion Thread

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flight50
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Re: Kansas Discussion Thread

#441 Post by flight50 » 30 Mar 2023 06:13

@Bedavd Yes I just peeked at ads678's map and he most definitely got in Emporia nicely. He doesn't have Pittsburg in though. We know his map is concerative so if he got it to fit, SCS will get it to fit and then some. He also has Salina in so I'm hoping that follows his map. Now I don't think Hutchinson makes it though. We can get the Loves truck stop off KA-14 and then the truck wash off KA-61 and roll right thru Hutchinson as a scenic town. Swap that one for Pittsburg.

Dodge City is interchangeable with Liberal. I see Liberal making it over Dodge City if only one makes it though. Dodge City can go scenic or marked. SCS did get Amarillo and Dalhart in due to livestock for Texas. Same thing could happen with Liberal and Dodge and we get both to emphasis processing plants. Between Oklahoma and Kansas, one of them should really bring processing onboard in ATS.
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rbsanford
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Re: Kansas Discussion Thread

#442 Post by rbsanford » 30 Mar 2023 07:35

I can see Hutchinson making it in. It may be close to Wichita, but it's a significant city with a lot of industry, including salt production and the world's largest grain elevator (I think it's this one; there's also a grocery distributor right next to it).

When it comes to Dodge City vs. Liberal, I think Dodge City should be marked, since there's more industry, and it's more significant. But just by eyeballing it, I think both could work. There's also Garden City, which could probably just have outlying depots for Dodge City; if the map scale were larger, Garden should be marked as well, but as things are, I think that would be too dense.

I'm wondering what'll be done north of I-70. Maybe Manhattan could be marked; I always thought that Emporia was too close to Topeka for marking, but that's likely been confirmed, and Manhattan is just about the same distance. Then there's US 36: without that, there'll be a big void between I-70 and I-80, so I wonder what towns along that stretch could be marked.
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oldmanclippy
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Re: Kansas Discussion Thread

#443 Post by oldmanclippy » 30 Mar 2023 12:58

I agree that Colby, Hays, and Emporia have been all but confirmed as marked by this blog. SCS has been 100% consistent on cities vs settlements wording for marked vs scenic in recent years.

I also agree that this blog seems to, shockingly, heavily heavily support the inclusion of Kansas City, Missouri. You just can't see that building close enough from KCK to make that detail justified, unless they're making the entire KCM skyline at high quality now so there's less work later but that doesn't make much sense to me. Also while SCS's marketing for Oklahoma has been a bit careless, they're not dumb. They know we look up where all these screenshots are located and they wouldn't put a screenshot from KCM if they didn't want us to discover it and get excited for it. I'm including KCM in my prediction map until we hear otherwise.

The place in KC that that would be visible from would be I-70 @ I-670 @ US-71. Not sure if that interchange will be modeled or if it will be simplified to just be a bend in I-70 and there won't be an interchange there. I-49 does continue onto US-71 north to Kansas City (that'd be for the Missouri DLC) so it would make sense to include that interchange in the Kansas DLC. We'll see.

That announcement of 12 marked cities is a boon to concept map nerds like me :lol: Now I know exactly how many I need to have in there. Currently I have 13, including KCK and my sleeper pick of El Dorado. But I think now that it's more likely that the El Dorado refinery would just be tied to Wichita, now that we know that we know the limit of 12 marked cities.

Hutchinson I think could get marked. I'm working off the assumption with a good degree of confidence that the following cities are going to be included:

Topeka
Salina
Hays
Colby
Pittsburg
Wichita
Garden City
Something in the north-central like Belleville or Marysville
Kansas City, Missouri
Emporia

That's already 10 right there and I find it tough to eliminate any of them, especially now that we basically know we're getting 8/10. With Garden City and the northern city that I think we'll get being the 2 that haven't been mentioned or hinted at, and it's only March :lol: I agree with flight50 that Dodge City and Liberal are interchangeable for marked, but I think Liberal is just too close to Guymon to work, especially since we know that Guymon will get depots northeast of town along US-54 which constricts the distance even more. So Dodge City is my pick for now between those two. That would leave the 12th city between Hutchinson, Manhattan, or a sleeper pick in the south-central of the state maybe. Manhattan is too close to Topeka IMO, and there aren't any obvious options in the south-central, so Hutchinson will stay on my map as marked for now.

...

I really enjoyed reading this blog and I hope they will do more like it for future projects.
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flight50
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Re: Kansas Discussion Thread

#444 Post by flight50 » 30 Mar 2023 17:21

I've always advocated that the Kansas dlc needs Kansas City as part of its dlc and let Missouri showcase St. Louis. I hope SCS saw it this way to get more hype into Kansas. Otherwise, what hype does Kansas have to promote it? The name in Kansas City just sounds like it should belong to Kansas dlc. Despite most of KC being in Missouri, SCS can depict their game anyway they'd like. I think Missouri can sell itself. St. Louis/Springfield vs Kansas City/Wichita......add the supporting cast of smaller cities and I really like KC going to Kansas. I'd rather one large city than trying to do KCK and KCM or even Overland Park. Work out everything for KC as a whole in one dlc. It takes time and resources to redo stuff. This is what's going on in the phasing stuff for California.....redoing stuff from a previous phase. It takes resources to redo stuff. Plan it out thoroughly and try to avoid doing stuff twice.....move on to the next task....save time. There's a ton of the US to map.

As far as Guymon from Liberal........its only 40 miles apart. Dallas from Ft. Worth is 32 miles apart and they are huge cities compared to these small cities. Billings and Laurel, CDA to Spokane, San Francisco to Oakland, Portland to Vancouver, these are shorter than 40 miles apart. I ruled out distance a long time ago. If SCS sees industry justified, I don't think they should hold back marked cities being close to one another. They'll cut out other parts of a road instead just to bring cities that make sense for economy purposes. Dodge City and Liberal can fit I bet. If SCS is bold enough to finally give us processing plants, I find it very very difficult to not have both cities if they use the same prefab. No Global Mills. We need something brand new for processing. Now if they give us 2 totally different depots, yes one of those cities could be scenic.

There are more processing plants in the Midwest that SCS can get in the game. So 2 processing plant depots is ideal. One with Oklahoma for Guymon and one with Kansas. If we get one in Guymon and a different one in Liberal or Dodge City, that gives 2 plants to worth of diversity. The problem with depots is that you can only use one depot type per city. The way to get around that is to have more marked cities and you can reuse depots like Walmart supermarket, Home Store, farms, quarries and others that are common in cities.....Or they have to create more depots with new names by either rebranding, or by brand new name/brand new depot. This presents a problem for scenic cities getting remote depots. Remote cities are tagged to marked cities. So either more marked cities or more depots.

I like Marysville off US-36. I do think we need US-36 connecting to US-385 from Colorado. US-36 gives us a reason to explore North of I-70. Its a straight shot across Kansas to St. Josesph's to I-29 and beyond. Hopefully we get US-36 in its full run after Colorado. If we get US-36, something needs to be marked on it for sure. Its kinda hard to say what road we get in Southern Kansas. The roads are not as linear to figure out what we get. We at least need US-400. Best case, we get further South with US-160 connecting to US-385 and run the distance in Southern Kansas. US-160 isn't the straight shot that US-36 is so with all the 90 deg turns or what not, there's actually a lot SCS can play with to squeeze it all in.
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Re: Kansas Discussion Thread

#445 Post by hangman005 » 31 Mar 2023 06:51

If it's a choice between Dodge City and Liberal personally I'd go with Dodge City for the reasons stated earlier with the additional benefit of having an achievement for taking a delivery from their called "Got out of Dodge"
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Re: Kansas Discussion Thread

#446 Post by Janaff » 31 Mar 2023 23:19

Legally speaking, the Kansas and Missouri halves of Kansas City are two different cities; it's perfectly possible that they will treat them separately in-game too, and I think it is the most likely option. While Kansas City MI is the bigger of the two, Kansas City KS is arguably more industrialised, so in-game I think they'd be quite equal.
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Re: Kansas Discussion Thread

#447 Post by oldmanclippy » 31 Mar 2023 23:47

Eh just pretend that Kansas City KS is called something different like Rail City KS. Then it's easier to see it as a suburb of Kansas City MO, and then it wouldn't make much sense to see it marked independently, just like any other suburb in the game.

It's not like Texarkana where it's basically one city split into two states. Kansas City MO is the main city of that metropolitan area, and Kansas City KS is a suburb.
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Re: Kansas Discussion Thread

#448 Post by angrybirdseller » 01 Apr 2023 03:41

Liberal would work its 40 miles from Guymon just spread out the deliveries all over the map with farms and grain towers and drop of points for trains to haul it out. Cities, Great Bend, Liberal, Emporia, Wichita, Hutchinson, Salina, Hays, Colby, Tokepa, Kansas City ,Pittsburg, Garden City.
The Dodge City and Garden along with Liberal will likely be the tossed one that marked. I think all three will be in the map just one or two of these marked.

They can showcase Kansas City in Kansas then the other in Missouri they could include both to be honest without problems.
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flight50
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Re: Kansas Discussion Thread

#449 Post by flight50 » 01 Apr 2023 06:44

When it comes to Kansas City, SCS will do what they see fit for themselves. There is nothing legal about how SCS goes about making these dlc's in regards to what works for them. We have to remind ourselves that ATS is how they want to put it together. Real life doesn't always apply here. Its not a 1:1 world. Nothing says they must have Kansas City split. In game terms, its makes sense to be one large city as if there is no borders to worry about just like any normal city is currently in the game. This game is built in sectors, not borders.

Assuming Texas 2.0 could turn out what can already be seen in the map editor with Texarkana, that city will more than likely guide the way on how they handle Kansas City. Between those 2 border cities, SCS could go either way. Marketing wise, KC is the largest city that can come to Kansas to help market it. Missouri has St. Louis to push it. It they split the 2.......fine. If Kansas gets all of it.......fine. Most people here will more than likely own both Kansas and Missouri so either way, we'll have the whole city.

Liberal I do hope it makes it as marked just like Dalhart, Tx surprise everyone. US-54 can be loaded up in that region with depots. Its justified with Liberal. Liberal can make it as a small town. 3-4 depots is all that's needed. Walmart, National Beef, a feeder lot and maybe the Equity Exchange grain elevator. SCS can get away with Liberal being like an Omak, Washington or a Cody Wyoming sized city. Guymon to Dodge is 122 miles apart. I'd rather see something split up distance. Instead of 2-3 scenic towns along that path, surely one marked city can make it along with at least 1 scenic town.

81 miles between Dodge City and Liberal is a cake walk for SCS providing economy. The road is not a straight road between the 2. If we get US-83 up from Texas, it will slice right thru Liberal on its way thru Garden City. Add in US-54 as the other road thru Liberal and we can get a nice Tri City area in Southwestern Kansas with some good industry. Both Dodge City and Garden City offer some pretty good industry. The best part is those cities are on US highways so that means no huge interchange junction taking up space. Dodge City can bring a loop where as Garden City can bring a nice path with US-400 thru the city.
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rbsanford
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Re: Kansas Discussion Thread

#450 Post by rbsanford » 01 Apr 2023 07:27

If KCM is included with Kansas, would it (and the Kansas side of the metro area) also be included with Missouri? It would have to be, since it's the largest city in the state, and you'll need it if you get Missouri and not Kansas. That's one of the reasons I'm not sold in having KCM in the Kansas DLC, but the main one is that we should have enough with what's on the Kansas side, which includes a car factory, two massive railyards, and a ton of other industry opportunities. If the concern here is confusion over having two identically named cities right next to each other, the Kansas side could be marked as Overland Park, which is the largest suburb of the Kansas City metro area, and the second-largest city in Kansas. I have to agree with oldmanclippy, in that this isn't like Texarkana; Kansas City can be more easily split.
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