Texas Discussion Thread

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flight50
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Re: Texas Discussion Thread

#4661 Post by flight50 » 13 Aug 2022 17:56

halbtollekreatur wrote: 13 Aug 2022 09:05 IF we can get it, it would a good opportunity to add a proper beverage trailer for downtown deliveries.
Beverage trucks connect to medium duty tractors. Not the Class 8 tractors we have in the game. Beverage trailers actually don't have a place in ATS without medium and multi drop

@gt379. Nice find. I'm sure Texas gets the new 57x though. Montana messed up the order. It was suppose to get the Cascadia, Texas the LT and Oklahoma the 57x. But the 9900i came into the mix and jumped ahead of the Cascadia and the LT to get to Montana's cover. For Texas, I can see marketing Texas goes great with the new 57x.

@AlexxxF1 Those number aren't so close imo. ETS2 was started with UK and German Simulator so they came with companies already. I'm really comparing numbers of companies per dlc once ATS released its first paid dlc which was NM. I think that was the same year Italy released which was 2017. Every dlc from that point on is when I noticed the flood of companies for ETS2 dlc's. So doing the math from Italy, Baltics, Black Sea, Iberia, the avg company is much much higher than 6.7 when comparing on an equal playing field for maps released for both games. On average is was well over 15 iirc starting in 2017.
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Re: Texas Discussion Thread

#4662 Post by 55sixxx » 13 Aug 2022 18:06

flight50 wrote: 13 Aug 2022 17:56 Beverage trucks connect to medium duty tractors. Not the Class 8 tractors we have in the game. Beverage trailers actually don't have a place in ATS without medium and multi drop
Well, we had them before... Don't see a reason why SCS may not add them. They do and add some things that are not 100% realistic as well, so there's that.
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halbtollekreatur
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Re: Texas Discussion Thread

#4663 Post by halbtollekreatur » 13 Aug 2022 19:52

flight50 wrote: 13 Aug 2022 17:56 Beverage trucks connect to medium duty tractors. Not the Class 8 tractors we have in the game. Beverage trailers actually don't have a place in ATS without medium and multi drop
I know. That's even a big problem with the 28ft trailers in AI traffic. I started to talk about it here and here. I main argument is that we have huge trucks pulling little trailers sometime.
But for the truck jobs I don't see that big problem because there are 2-axle chassis. BUT it would need rework of the trailer definitions, like I said in the thread if we don't want stuipd combinations in the quick jobs.
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Re: Texas Discussion Thread

#4664 Post by MT269 » 14 Aug 2022 03:19

An imitation of a sizeable truck stop with amenities/supplies could simply consist of a small shopping mall, with a petrol station. In regards to Sora's post on page 461.

Most of the layout is already in-game. But without a modest sized square in close proximity. It doesn't even need a name at all. It could be present without any logo, if they really want to try and bring such into the game. But to play it safe, SCS might be better off dividing the mall into two separate smaller blocks.

Even naming it something like Bruce('s) would be asking for trouble.
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Re: Texas Discussion Thread

#4665 Post by AlexxxF1 » 14 Aug 2022 04:53

AlexxxF1 wrote: 13 Aug 2022 15:45 well, talking about the diversity in ATS and ETS2 and constantly comparing them all times, in fact, the gap is minimal.

in ETS2 we have 26 states and 165 different companies represented. or an average of 6.3 dif companies per state.in scale 1:19.
in ATS_ we have 11 states and 56 different companies represented. or an average of 5.1 dif companies per state. in scale 1:20.

maybe that's why it's not so critical for me, and when I playing both games, I don't notice the difference and some kind of gap between them in terms of diversity of different companies.
flight50 wrote: 13 Aug 2022 17:56 @AlexxxF1 Those number aren't so close imo. ETS2 was started with UK and German Simulator so they came with companies already. I'm really comparing numbers of companies per dlc once ATS released its first paid dlc which was NM. I think that was the same year Italy released which was 2017. Every dlc from that point on is when I noticed the flood of companies for ETS2 dlc's. So doing the math from Italy, Baltics, Black Sea, Iberia, the avg company is much much higher than 6.7 when comparing on an equal playing field for maps released for both games. On average is was well over 15 iirc starting in 2017.
From my point of view, these figures are close, even if count by DLC.
In ETS2, for each DLC not only more new companies comes than in ATS. but also much more new cities in each DLC. or not ? :?:.
And that means much more free space. and which must necessarily be filled with diversity at least minimally.
And the main disadvantage of ETS2 compared to ATS - natural diversity, I think SCS was just trying to compensate somehow it.
diversify at least by adding more different companies in ETS2.
or at least try to. to catch ATS, if not by the diversity of nature, then at least by the diversity of companies.
So.

Starting 2017, in ATS we got not so big, but full 8 DLC and 103 different cities. an average of 13 cities per DLС.
Starting 2017, in ETS2 we got so big, but only 4 DLC and 138 different cities. an average of 35 cities per DLС.

that's why - "comparing numbers of companies per dlc" and "On average is was well over 15 iirc starting in 2017" - Yes it is.
it would be surprising if it were different. from each DLС in ETS2 we get 22 more new cities than in each ATS DLС. and only 15 iirc more.
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I decided to do some more calculations. and even take into account the scale somehow (but it doesn't really affect):D .
_ if starting 2017 _.
How many new companies per new city..
To the current time, the difference between ETS2 and ATS is already just only 2 times.
( starting 2017, in ETS2 100 new companies with 138 new cities in 1:19 scale - 100 / 138 = 0,72 x 19 = 13,6 ).
( starting 2017, in ATS 34 new companies with 103 new cities in 1:20 scale - 34 / 103 = 0,33 x 20 = 6,6 ).

_ if all the time _.
How many different companies per city. :idea:.
At the current time,the difference between ETS2 and ATS is already just only 1,5 times.
( in ETS2 165 companies with 282 cities in 1:19 scale - 165 / 282 = 0,58 x 19 = 11 ).
( in ATS 56 companies with 151 cities in 1:20 scale - 56 / 151 = 0,37 x 20 = 7,4 ).
_ if all the time _.
How many different companies per different states :idea:.
At the current time, the difference between ETS2 and ATS is already just only 1,17 times.
( in ETS2 165 companies in 26 different states in 1:19 scale - 165 / 26 = 6,3 x 19 = 119,7 ).
( in ATS 56 companies in 11 different states in 1:20 scale - 56 / 11 = 5,1 x 20 = 102 ).

As we see, all difference between ETS2 and ATS - when - companies per city just only 1,5 times and companies per states just only 1,17 times - ETS2 and ATS are almost equal.
:!: SCS failed to diversify ETS2 much compared to ATS.
When in ATS -so great diversity in nature - in ETS2 there was not even so much compensated by diversity in new companies.
The only thing where ETS2 is ahead of ATS so far is in the number and variety of cities. 282 vs 151.
but even here the difference is not much. less than 2 times. only 1,87. (or 1,77 if somehow try to take into account dif scale too).
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Re: Texas Discussion Thread

#4666 Post by flight50 » 14 Aug 2022 11:57

@AlexxxF1 Nice work on the numbers. That gives us a more precise break down comparison at least. I'll take your word for it on the numbers. I'm not going to do the math on it.

In regards to ATS having natural diversity.......that's not apples to apples so its not a fair judgement. Comparing nature diversity to natural diversity or comparing companies to companies is fair judgement. You're saying SCS is penalizing ATS for something that can't be controlled. It is what it is on the landscape. The US becomes much more Europe like the further East we go. North America as a whole, the entire West is naturally diverse. Sure there are the Appalachian Mountains to come in the East but they are not the Rocky Mountains. You can't associate landscaping with company diversity though. It doesn't work like that. I know its your opinion but I doubt very seriously that is what SCS was thinking like.

The bottom line (which Pavel recently admitted on the Montana stream) is that SCS has not focused on cargo and features. Features is not the subject I'm getting at but cargo is. Cargo is apart of ICCs. The more industries, the more cargoes are developed. The more cargoes developed the deeper the industries get. The more industries, the more new companies. There's about another 10-12 industries that SCS could implement into ATS. I don't expect them all but there are some noteworthy ones out there. I mentioned them last week so I won't repost them here. When all three are jiving (ICCs), the logistics world can be a bit richer than what it is now. Retail, Logistics companies, Agriculture (anything related to food production) and construction are main 4 that should have several companies in those categories already. Each one of those has like 2-4 different areas under their industries that can add depth. It part of the their industry chain that is missing as well in ATS.
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Re: Texas Discussion Thread

#4667 Post by AlexxxF1 » 14 Aug 2022 14:27

@flight50 I can agree with you. on average for each 1 company in ATS, we got 3 companies in ETS2.
But on average too for each 3 cities in ATS, we got almost 6 cities in ETS2.
This is more space in ETS2 that must be filled with more variety, at least at a minimum.. I meant only this.
just a huge gap as it seems at first glance between ATS and ETS2 is not really.
But you are right, ATS has a huge potential ( especially given the addition of Mexico and Canada in the future).

In any case, I completely agree with you. The more new companies the better for both games and for us.
even using rebranding or branches. If this is not quite suitable for ETS2, given more space and scale in 1DLC, then in ATS it may work in some places pretty good, when 1 DLC so small.

I am from new companies and getting production chains will be very cool. a box of 3-5 links, at least for a start.
Although we have some. for example, logging and from the thicket we transport finished logs to the sawmill - from the sawmill we transport finished boards to a hardware store - from a hardware store we transport finished boards for sale to build houses.
such chains really make the world feel alive.
until Oregon came along, it was impossible to realize this. more new DLC maps, more opportunities and open areas for creating chains I think.
And that's partly too, why I would like us to finally start getting 3 small DLC for ATC per year (maybe then 3 small DLС for ATS can be compared and can be equal to 1 large DLС for ETS2).
Last edited by AlexxxF1 on 14 Aug 2022 14:29, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Texas Discussion Thread

#4668 Post by oldmanclippy » 14 Aug 2022 14:28

SCS is a company selling a product, so we should really be looking at companies per dollar and over time. SCS has charged $95.92 for 33 ATS companies in DLC states for a waiting time of 6 years, while ETS2 Beyond the Baltic Sea brought 33 companies for $17.99 for a waiting time of 1 year. That should be the most concerning statistic and the easiest way to understand why ATS players are so frustrated with the state of companies in-game. That they've been drip-fed over such a long time span over the course of so many paid DLCs has made their small number even worse.
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Re: Texas Discussion Thread

#4669 Post by flight50 » 14 Aug 2022 16:02

Yes the dollar per company in each game is scale tipper. One good thing though that recently happened is Pavel acknowledging cargo and features on the Montana stream will be a focus. Lets hope the doors and eyes are now opened. Features will come when they can but ICC's, they must come per dlc in a decent amount. Now like I've said a few times, its not always possible to bring a new industry for every map dlc in ATS. But what can come every time is new companies or deeper chains for an existing industry. No way should we ever get another Idaho. What could Idaho have easily done if it didn't bring anything new? Target, one off Micron (not Charged), WinCo Foods, Albertsons, Lowes, Whole Foods, a new farm company, Cabela's, Nampa Sugar factory (we have Sweet Beets now, we need cane sugar though), Kohl's, Hobby Lobby, Dick's Sporting Goods, Costco's, one off Simplot Foods, Sam's club....just to name a few. That is 15 right there.

All those except the one offs, guess what. They are all in Texas. 11 of those I just named are pretty much national. Eleven! That helps all of ATS now and in the future. They are in several other states. So if Idaho could have made more retail to take up the slack for no new industries, some of those depots could have been used in Colorado, Wyoming, Montana, Texas and beyond. They could get worked into the California rebuild and other older paid dlc's. Its these type companies that I wish SCS takes a step back and look at all the national companies now and get them accounted for to add options to cities to avoid using so many fake Walmarts along with other overused companies. Then SCS can look at regional companies as they get to x,y and z. But nationally, find out where these places are and how they work with ATS. A huge amount of cargo is for the end user and the product chains have to go thru several hands first before retail gets it. So retail wise, there needs to be a lot more of them as tons of products are made via factories and tons are imported and exported into the economy. I'd love to see a better reflected logistics system than what we have.

The map itself will take care of itself. We'll get that quality. But what functional depots comes with those maps. To many missing factories, distribution centers...the middle men companies. We need lot of middleman companies in order to make a complete product chain in a lot of cases. I just hope Texas makes the effort to bring some of these middel man companies. Its to big to not have one offs or aid in the middle man roster.
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Re: Texas Discussion Thread

#4670 Post by killingjoke28336 » 14 Aug 2022 19:26

Still hoping for Presidio but I highly doubt it. But it would be so cool to get into that remote area.
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