why scs software doesn't care about graphics in game?

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JoeAlex23
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Re: why scs software doesn't care about graphics in game?

#271 Post by JoeAlex23 » 15 May 2022 20:17

Yeah sure, let's ignore all the millions of $ and manhours Rockstar/Take Two invested into their RAGE engine to make it better after the massive unoptimized POS it was for GTA IV..... 🙄
Viper28
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Re: why scs software doesn't care about graphics in game?

#272 Post by Viper28 » 15 May 2022 23:28

JoeAlex23 wrote: 15 May 2022 20:17 Yeah sure, let's ignore all the millions of $ and manhours Rockstar/Take Two invested into their RAGE engine to make it better after the massive unoptimized POS it was for GTA IV..... 🙄
it's like a moving target with some of you guys. One moment SCS' engine is actually "doing more" because it's a "whole world" engine, and then in the next it's unfair because R* has poured money, time, and upgrades into their RAGE engine? So which is it? I've played both GTA V and IV and they both performed better than the current ATS game world.
"Change is the law of life. And those who look only to the past or present are certain to miss the future" -JFK
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Re: why scs software doesn't care about graphics in game?

#273 Post by JoeAlex23 » 15 May 2022 23:54

@Viper28 That answer must not be for me because i have never said such BS, SCS is just used to their own engine and their pipeline of work, there's nothing special about Prism3D, doesn't matter how many people want to believe that, also, when GTA IV was released for PC it was horrible and not even the best PC's of that time could run it good, it improved a lot with updates but it was VERY bad and even to this day some modern PC's have a hard time running it maxed out, GTA V fixed all of that but thanks to the massive budget Rockstar poured into it and turned it basically into the perfect game, something that SCS doesn't have the luxury of doing, you're taking things way out of line, comparing SCS to Rockstar is a very dumb comparation.
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Re: why scs software doesn't care about graphics in game?

#274 Post by Optional Features » 16 May 2022 02:25

I don't think it's dumb at all. Rockstar is undoubtedly one of the top game developers in the world, and SCS should be aiming to get to that level in a general sense. Secondly, SCS should be looking to maximize its resources within the confines of its budget to deliver the best game possible.

Will SCS ever be Rockstar or beat Rockstar? Likely not.

But can SCS learn some things from Rockstar? Absolutely.

There are a lot of things about GTA 5 that have no application to SCS, but there are plenty more things that do. A list of things that do includes:
  • Mountains and trees: in the GTA 5 map, these seem like a realistic height compared to their surroundings. SCS mountains and trees seem to be capped and incredibly short given the unlimited vertical space available.
  • Hills: in the GTA 5 map, hills are steep and challenging to drive at high speed. I can only imagine what their representation of a mountain pass would be like: SCS repeatedly underwhelms in this area.
  • Sense of scale: the SCS map doesn't feel large, even with addons. States pass in a blip, even crossing a continent seems like only a matter of a couple hours. GTA 5's much smaller map feels far larger than it should, likely due to the nearly unlimited places a player can go. There aren't constant walls, invisible barriers, and gates blocking players from exploring areas of the map that are already developed.
  • Pedestrian/animal life: SCS rarely includes animals in its maps, and the few pedestrians on the street are nearly as rare. Just walking around the GTA 5 map is enjoyable as there is a buzz of activity that changes with the weather and time of day. I don't expect this level of detail with SCS maps, but anything is better than the current near nothing.
  • Confusing layouts: this is perhaps the best part of playing GTA 5, the fact that you can get lost in a city if you take the wrong street. Even industrial zones like the port are as confusing as you'd expect them to be irl. There aren't markers and barriers directing the player to exact locations. It's an open world that's overwhelming for a newbie and still engaging for an oldie.
  • Bumps and imperfections in road surface: GTA 5 roads are what SCS roads should be at this point. They are uneven, have potholes, are sometimes undergoing construction work, etc. With force feedback enabled on a wheel, they are a challenge to drive, as they should be. SCS could learn the most from Rockstar in this area.
  • AI vehicle diversity: GTA 5 spawns different cars in different neighborhoods, and vehicles vary greatly even in certain areas. There are motorcycles, supercars, old vehicles, semis, garbage trucks, and more. It's a decently appropriate representation of what would be seen irl in various parts of a city.
  • Lighting and shadows: with a free graphics mod, GTA 5's aged graphics come to life, showcasing a proper sunrise, bright day, evening glow, sunset, and dark night. There are stars in the sky, and lights from buildings cast shadows on vehicles. It's an experience to drive around, and an enjoyable one.
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Re: why scs software doesn't care about graphics in game?

#275 Post by JoeAlex23 » 16 May 2022 02:37

That's all i hear from someone with 0 experience about game developing... Sure, there are things to learn but not as you describe them, don't even bother answering me again...
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Re: why scs software doesn't care about graphics in game?

#276 Post by Optional Features » 16 May 2022 03:41

JoeAlex23 wrote: 16 May 2022 02:37 That's all i hear from someone with 0 experience about game developing... Sure, there are things to learn but not as you describe them, don't even bother answering me again...
And all I hear from people like you is excuses. Excuses why SCS can't do this, can't do that, can't change, can't improve, can't learn, can't be like clearly successful companies. Excuses, excuses, excuses.

People compare themselves to people all the time. It's the nature of life. If you see someone with a nice car or a nice house, you notice. It doesn't mean that you have to become them. It means that they have something worth considering and perhaps you can improve yourself in some way to get better things of your own.

But as typical, no one wants to have a conversation. I'll add you to my growing foe list lol.
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Re: why scs software doesn't care about graphics in game?

#277 Post by JoeAlex23 » 16 May 2022 04:31

Go ahead, i don't give a F, it's impossible to have a conversation with you because you want things to be YOUR way and ONLY your way, when someone that has experience on the matter tries to explain something to you it completely flies over your head and unless it is what you want to hear you don't care...
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Re: why scs software doesn't care about graphics in game?

#278 Post by Travismods » 16 May 2022 10:41

@seriousmods Don't even bother with some of these users, all they repertoire consists of is "You don't know how game development / how x works" and "SCS could but you see they don't want to, or they can't afford, shouldn't, can't because Pavel said in a stream its not perfect, and they shouldn't cater to you, and the tired old "you can't compare SCS to any other company no matter the aspect because they have more money and you don't know anything" and just more and more and more excuses. Then they always take some minute detail in what you wrote, turn it around on you and ignore 95% of your comment to win an argument, its always the same thing. It gets so old.

I always ask myself, if these users here have such deep knowledge and expertise in game development and all other subjects that they keep telling us with such confidence that we "know nothing about it" - why do they spend most their own time on a truck sim forum telling others they know nothing about game development and these subjects? Strange way to spend your time as a developer, I say that as a developer myself. No developers, teachers, mentors or experts on any subjects I have met spend their days telling others "you don't know anything about x" when discussions arise. I have actually never met a person knowledgeable about any subject that express themselves like that. Statements like that should serve as a big alarm bell. True experts on topics with actual knowledge don't react like that when their views are challenged. But some people don't want a discussion, they just want to shut down an opinion that goes against theirs.
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Re: why scs software doesn't care about graphics in game?

#279 Post by Optional Features » 16 May 2022 15:52

koolizz wrote: 16 May 2022 10:41 @seriousmods Don't even bother with some of these users, all they repertoire consists of is "You don't know how game development / how x works" and "SCS could but you see they don't want to, or they can't afford, shouldn't, can't because Pavel said in a stream its not perfect, and they shouldn't cater to you, and the tired old "you can't compare SCS to any other company no matter the aspect because they have more money and you don't know anything" and just more and more and more excuses. Then they always take some minute detail in what you wrote, turn it around on you and ignore 95% of your comment to win an argument, its always the same thing. It gets so old.

I always ask myself, if these users here have such deep knowledge and expertise in game development and all other subjects that they keep telling us with such confidence that we "know nothing about it" - why do they spend most their own time on a truck sim forum telling others they know nothing about game development and these subjects? Strange way to spend your time as a developer, I say that as a developer myself. No developers, teachers, mentors or experts on any subjects I have met spend their days telling others "you don't know anything about x" when discussions arise. I have actually never met a person knowledgeable about any subject that express themselves like that. Statements like that should serve as a big alarm bell. True experts on topics with actual knowledge don't react like that when their views are challenged. But some people don't want a discussion, they just want to shut down an opinion that goes against theirs.
It's kinda like people who spend tons of time here praising SCS instead of playing their games. Very odd lol
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Re: why scs software doesn't care about graphics in game?

#280 Post by JoeAlex23 » 16 May 2022 16:34

koolizz wrote: 16 May 2022 10:41 I always ask myself, if these users here have such deep knowledge and expertise in game development and all other subjects that they keep telling us with such confidence that we "know nothing about it" - why do they spend most their own time on a truck sim forum telling others they know nothing about game development and these subjects? Strange way to spend your time as a developer, I say that as a developer myself. No developers, teachers, mentors or experts on any subjects I have met spend their days telling others "you don't know anything about x" when discussions arise. I have actually never met a person knowledgeable about any subject that express themselves like that. Statements like that should serve as a big alarm bell. True experts on topics with actual knowledge don't react like that when their views are challenged. But some people don't want a discussion, they just want to shut down an opinion that goes against theirs.
If all of that BS was aimed directly at me, i will just say, i'm not an active developer anymore and i can do whatever i want with my free time, i spent years of my life studying software development and worked on some big projects, i have experience and know how things work on a games and apps development environment, i'm out of that industry for certain things that i don't care to share but that doesn't make my point of view/statement wrong like most of the things said on this forum from people that have 0 idea what they are talking about, i'm not an expert and never claimed to be one but at least i know what i'm talking about, with that said, believe whatever you want, i don't care anymore...
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